Chris Wilson: What I think about ES4
Dean Edwards wrote:
blogs.msdn.com/cwilso/archive/2007/10/31/what-i-think-about-es4.aspx
Rather than respond directly, I'd just like to concur with what Brendan wrote (in case someone here missed it):
weblogs.mozillazine.org/roadmap/archives/2007/10/open_letter_to_chris_wilson.html
Chris Pine Opera Software
After the heated debate, I took time to write my opinion on the subject, for what it's worth :
On 11/3/07, Nicolas Cannasse <ncannasse at motion-twin.com> wrote:
After the heated debate, I took time to write my opinion on the subject, for what it's worth :
Debate? Where? I didn't see any debate on Chris' blog. It looked more like something we could expect to see from American politicians; or a good episode of Jerry Springer. Some vague claims, some suggestions, some accusations, but no debate. I want to see facts, cold, reasoned analysis, pros/cons. Real debate. And I want to see it here; debate on ES4 belongs here, on this list, not scattered through various blogs.
Chris, where are you?
Garrett
Nicolas Cannasse wrote:
I personaly don't care about Microsoft opinion EXCEPT that they are the ones doing Internet Explorer (IE), you know, that (still) 80% market share internet browser, the one your users are visiting your website with...
So, as developers, we're out of luck.
Mozilla and Adobe thought the same and came up with the ScreamingMonkey project, which is an ES4 runtime that can be installed for Internet Explorer. Nice, but how long will that work ? Given that Microsoft has no intention of helping, I can foresee that each IE/Windows update will break something.
I thought that ScreamingMonkey planned on using a published & fairly stable API to do this. Does anyone know of non-Microsoft users of this API? How hard would it be for them to break it?
Assuming that vbscript and silverlight use this same API, I have to think they'd be pretty conservative with it. Even if it were to change, it couldn't be that hard for ScreamingMonkey to keep up.
Mitch
On 04/11/2007, Mitch Skinner <lists at arctur.us> wrote:
Nicolas Cannasse wrote:
Mozilla and Adobe thought the same and came up with the ScreamingMonkey project, which is an ES4 runtime that can be installed for Internet Explorer. Nice, but how long will that work ? Given that Microsoft has no intention of helping, I can foresee that each IE/Windows update will break something.
I thought that ScreamingMonkey planned on using a published & fairly stable API to do this. Does anyone know of non-Microsoft users of this API? How hard would it be for them to break it?
Very, very hard. The API might not be considered the most well designed any longer, but there's hooks for it absolutely everywhere. Most notably, it's used by WSH (the windows scripting host), by IIS (in ASP), by IE, by outlook, by visual studio etc.
Microsoft has a compatibility nightmare if they decide to change it by any other means than adding new features.
Assuming that vbscript and silverlight use this same API, I have to think they'd be pretty conservative with it. Even if it were to change, it couldn't be that hard for ScreamingMonkey to keep up.
First of all, Silverlight uses a brand new scripting engine, called Managed JScript, that runs on the DLR on top of the .NET CLR. Managed JScript doesn't use the Active Scripting APIs at all, from what I've read about it.
Second, Microsoft can do absolutely nothing to it except for additions. There are outside users of these APIs from both sides, e.g. the ActiveScripting languages such as ActivePerl, ActivePython, ActiveRuby, HaskellScript use the API from the scripting engine side, while programs such as the JScript/VBScript external IDEs/debuggers as well as several in-house applications in major companies use the API from the host side.
On 11/4/07, liorean <liorean at gmail.com> wrote:
On 04/11/2007, Mitch Skinner <lists at arctur.us> wrote:
Nicolas Cannasse wrote:
Just curious, but am I the only one having trouble posting replies to Chris' blog?
I posted a response to his response and answered his question that he asked me; absolutely nothing inflammatory or even rude in my post. Just trying to figure out if it's just me.
On 11/4/07, liorean <liorean at gmail.com> wrote:
On 04/11/2007, Mitch Skinner <lists at arctur.us> wrote:
Nicolas Cannasse wrote:
Just curious, but am I the only one having trouble posting replies to Chris' blog?
I posted a response to his response and answered his question that he asked me; absolutely nothing inflammatory or even rude in my post. Just trying to figure out if it's just me.
blogs.msdn.com/cwilso/archive/2007/10/31/what-i-think-about-es4.aspx